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Post by seniorgunner on Nov 15, 2009 8:50:17 GMT -5
At the last meet Jim C the safe officer brought up the issue of some members using a 50 cal Barret rifle on the 100 yard range. He felt it was unsafe in light if our insurance regulations not covering accidents and wanted to discuss the use of them--thats the way I understood it--Just my view of course Senior-Gunner
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Post by M1Riflenut on Nov 15, 2009 11:25:52 GMT -5
Looking over the range rules again, I don't see much that needs change or that I think needs improvement. The rules are good,the problem is people not following them. The biggest abuse I notice are when people bring guests,they don't pay attention to them and usually let them be "on their own". How many of these guests even know how to safely handle a firearm? How many have never had any type of safety class or lessons? I ran into this 1/3 of the time this year.(I've only made it out three times though ) Anytime I'm out there I usually always have someone with me, family members or freinds etc. I have NEVER just sat down at my own table and let them "go at it". Many of the times I've brought guests I don't even fire anything myself,or if I do it is'nt much,except for skeet shooting where everyone takes their turn. With guests I'm normally right on top of them making sure they know what to do and when to do it. My goal is to try and turn someone onto guns or a particular gun,whether it be a novice or a seasoned hunter/shooter. Personally,I think that is the biggest safety issue we have,guests that are not properly supervised by the member they came with. Next after that is how well trained are our members themselves? With all the new members we've got over the past few years,how many have had to show they can safely handle a gun via live fire range time or at minimum a safety class? Are they checked out by the board before they get a key or is it just assumed that they know what they are doing? There has been more than one occasion when I've left the range wondering how in the hell did that/those moron(s) ever get in? At the other end of that statement there is the amount of times I've run into total newbies that are all ears and questions about everything in general,from safety and range rules to types of guns,how they work,ammo,reloading etc. These folks are a joy to talk to as the majority of them are so eager to "get it right". On the .50 cal. issue, I'm not sure where I stand on that. I don't really think the 100 yd backstop is enough if the shot is high,but if kept at ground level it is. Should that be a concern? Yep. If anything happens and the club gets sued,we all lose. Dave
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Post by st19575 on Nov 15, 2009 22:59:43 GMT -5
by 50 cal barret i assume we're talking about 50bmg. i have an issue with rule changes, i don't think people paying four dollars a round just throw them away taking crappy shots. i would hate to have people think that if they buy one they have no place to shoot it or practice with it. with the club's financial situation improving the way it has i would have no objection to seeing the berms improved on both of the longer ranges. at this point i think we might want to survey members about what they shoot and see what direction that points us in. these larger "luxury" calibers are going to be more and more popular with serious shooters, especially with reloaders. barrets and other large bolt actions like it are a potent and attractive niche in the sport. i think if we have enough members with that kind of interest in the sport we should seriously consider accomodating them. someone with one of these rifles is going to be a long term member, not a one time no renew. if we do anything i think we should top off the berms on the the two longer ranges and then have jim or rick do an at the range orientation with new members with large calibers to make sure they're good to go. as far as the guests issue goes, i don't think a limit is appropriate. this is a recruitment issue, which is a financial issue. i have seen very few large parties without multiple members present, and i have been there a few times this year. what we might want in place is a suggestion that large parties over a number that we all agree on give rick or jim a call when they're on site so that they know. if they choose to drop in and either supervise or join in then that's up to them. i think members should have the option to bring a good sized gathering of either co workers or family members without having to worry about the body count. i spent a good part of the good weather this year working up a substantial pile of cordwood. next year, when i don't have to do much more than simple yard work i plan to spend a great amount of time over there. i have alot of family that shoots and they all carry phones and these gatherings tend to grow. if there's a limit set i hope it's reasonable. a low limit will make it to manage, but the larger issue is that we're all trying to pass along a skill or craft to our friends and families and that has to be encouraged, not discouraged. that's how you grow the sport and the club. thanks for the opportunity to vent, i think this meeting is a meeting that we should attend if concerned, i'm glad that rick saw fit to notify everyone.
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Post by travis on Nov 16, 2009 9:53:59 GMT -5
I think the "venting" that st19575 did was very valid and had a lot of good points. As a new member, paying for a yearly membership, I think it may have discouraged my decision to join if there were many restrictions on the firearms allowed at the range along with a harsh guest restriction. In the same aspect I do think that looking at the guest policy and maybe starting a large caliber safety brief is not a bad idea. I am giving my input here because I work 2nd shift and cannot attend the meetings and think that the more views you have the better.
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Post by LFGC Board Admin on Nov 17, 2009 16:27:59 GMT -5
I have sent this to Carl Martin. He is the gentleman who notified us all of this meeting. Hello Carl, I must go on record stating that this is highly irregular. Notice for a meeting concerning a rule change went out 3 days prior to the meeting date. No agenda has been offered to the club membership. Is there a reason why this matter can not be addressed at the regular club meeting? Even if a serious range safety issue exists, would it not be more appropriate to suspend the alleged dangerous activity until it may be addressed by the entire club membership in a more timely manner? Is there an agenda for this meeting? To avoid conjecture and speculation, is it possible for one to be distributed prior to the meeting so that we may have an opportunity to review the information which Jim will be covering? It seems that if the general topic(s) is/are relating to range rules then we may need time to fully prepare for the item(s) to be addressed. Time to perform the necessary research and consult the appropriate subject matter experts may be required to cover certain topics. Not knowing the subject of the meeting is severely limiting to those who may wish to be heard. While I am not arguing the validity of such a meeting at this time, I am concerned that it is being called with very short notice and without any actual information regarding the topic being presented to the membership. A change in the range rules is a very serious concern for us all. Any discussion should be presented to the entire membership in a manner which would permit participation by as many members as possible. That would include advanced notification of the topics to be discussed and more than 3 days notice. Any assistance you may be able to provide will be greatly appreciated. Thank you, There really isn't a whole lot to be concerned about at this point. No rule change can go into effect until proposed by motion at a regular club meeting, tabled for 30 days then voted on at the following club meeting. Its in the bylaws. Just to let you know where I stand, I am of the opinion that we do not need to modify our rules at all. First, there are very few members who shoot a 50BMG. I am talking perhaps four at most. Second, eliminating one caliber of any kind is a slippery slope. If we eliminate the 50BMG rifles, why not a 458 Lott? Why not the 455 Marlin? Why not the 45-70 Govt? Its just the wrong direction. Finally, this is a solution is search of a problem. It is immaterial "what" kind of firearm is being used. If a member is out at the range with a 22-250 and is handling/shooting in a manner that compromises safety, the end result is the same. As for members bringing guests, perhaps we need to address that issue. While I do not mean changing the way it is, perhaps a few members bringing in more than a reasaonable number of people need to be spoken to about specifically what is expected of them, the intent of the guest policy and why bringing in a whole gang is not reasonable. If somebody is going to bring a whole bunch of people for a function that needs to be cleared through the board...I think that is made clear at new member orientation. Finally, ever since we disciplined a member, there exists this police-state-like mentality...we need to get rid of that entirely.
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